Did We Mention We’re White Doodz?

Rachel Maddow has a great vlog up at AlterNet about how Republicans know their presidential candidates have nothing going for them at this point other than being white, male, and willing to “protect the children.” She mentions Novakula’s recent outburst that “only the Democratic Party, with everything in their favor would [decide that] this is the year to either have a woman or an African-American to break precedent…and it gives the Republicans hope,” and Gonzo’s insistence that he won’t resign because he’s “going to stay focused on protecting our kids,” and then goes on to Mitt Romney’s new ad where he promises to “clean up the water in which our kids and grandkids are swimming,” but not the actual water—just the cultural water.

The Republican candidates, Maddow notes, are not on the right side of any of the issues that are important to Americans, so all they can do is point out they’re white doodz who will totally protect teh childrenz! Oh—and they all totally hate abortion and teh gayz, no matter what you’ve heard!

In other words, the closer we get to the election, the more we’re going to start hearing about “tradition” again—because it’s the ultimate GOP dog whistle.

The GOP is the party that will protect traditional values. That’s what we hear all the time. Don’t want the radical homosexual agenda to render marriage and families obsolete? Vote Republican! Don’t want abortion to be used by soulless hussies as a form of birth control? Vote Republican! Don’t want erase our identity as a Christian nation? Vote Republican! Don’t want to see Christmas and Easter made illegal? Vote Republican!

Never mind whether the threats aren’t true; the message is what’s important, and it’s quite clear: Republicans will protect your way of life and what you believe in. They’ll protect tradition.

Liberals see an American tradition of slowly but surely making good on that promise of equality for every citizen, but we tend to call it “progress” and ourselves “progressives.” Social conservatives, on the other hand, define American tradition as the good old days, when there was no question that men were superior to women, straights were superior to gays, and whites were superior to everyone else. They want to preserve and protect that “tradition,” and, though some of them call themselves culture warriors, mostly they call themselves “traditionalists.”

Not only is that shorter than “sexist, racist, homophobic retrofuck jackholes,” but it sounds a lot nicer, too.

“Tradition” is the kind of word that appeals to people who don’t pay attention all that much, but might have a notion that the world is changing more rapidly than they can comfortably keep up with, who have heard some things about how feminism is responsible for the breakdown in the family and maybe that explains why all of Junior’s friends are such smart-alecks; maybe their mothers are feminists. “Tradition” is a word that plays well with that mushy middle, who can’t be bothered to examine anything too closely.

But it’s an even better word for speaking to the unabashed bigots of the base, reassuring them that they’re right to hate women and gays and brown people, and promising them, without saying as much, they’ll be protected from the onslaught of the radical hordes. America’s great tradition of conferring undeserved privilege on you won’t fail. Not on our watch. “Tradition” is the ultimate dog whistle to the social conservative base.

Last year in Tennessee, where the bitter Senate race between white Republican Bob Corker and black Democrat Harold Ford, Jr. escalated into one of the ugliest campaigns in recent memory, the GOP sent out a flyer to voters which said across its top: “Vote early to preserve your way of life.” It was immediately called out for its nefarious implications, as well it should have been—when social conservatives issue promises to protect tradition, our first response should be pointing out the tradition to which they refer is not worth protecting.

Proponents of “traditionalism” like to conjure images of the America that most Americans know from shows like Leave It to Beaver, but never experienced firsthand—it is a rare family indeed who never struggled for money, weathered a layoff, suffered an extended illness or loss, or fell out with each other, not to mention had no friends of color, gay friends (or members), or, ya know, daughters. The reality that most families aren’t a picture of Christian white perfection, and never were, doesn’t stop people from imagining the opposite, however. And that’s what makes “tradition” the ultimate dog whistle—it doesn’t just send a covert message, but makes people come running, panting and wagging their tales eagerly in search of a reward, a glorious something that never existed.

Of course, it the nonexistence of this perfect America, in spite of illusions to the contrary, that created the beloved “traditions” of racism, sexism, and homophobia in the first place. The dangling enticement of a happy family, supported by a single secure and well-paid job, in which no one is wracked with disillusionment, dispossession, or a lack of opportunity—an invitation to join for which most Americans are never given the chance to RSVP—creates the resentment and scapegoating that are the foundations of social conservative traditionalism. If I don’t have everything I want, it’s got to be somebody’s fault. And the GOP is always happy to point a finger in the direction of the already-marginalized.

They’re the ones—they’re the ones taking away what you deserve, the uppity niggers, the Jews, the illegals, the feminazis, the purveyors of the radical homosexual agenda. It’s them, but if you vote for us, we’ll protect you.

It’s the siren song that has hoodwinked generations of poor white Americans into voting for the GOP—and while the GOP keeps distracting them with promises to preserve tradition, they continue to redistribute wealth up the ladder away from them, doing precisely the thing they accuse the scapegoats of doing. But as long as there are scapegoats, the real culprit goes unnoticed by its victims.

That’s the tradition the GOP likes. And that’s the tradition they really want to protect.

Then there are the people who know the score, who get the game that’s being played, and don’t care—because they just liked things better when women and people of color and the LGBT community were to be unseen and unheard. They don’t like them. They don’t like the thought of working for a woman, or the thought of a black man marrying a nice white girl, or seeing two men holding hands on the street. And they call themselves “traditionalists” to mask their overt hatred of a changing world where their aesthetic only exists in podunk backwaters in which they’d never deign to live. It’s the height of insolence, in their view, that a metropolis like New York or Chicago has the temerity to be metropolitan—sophisticated, multicultural, progressive.

What a conundrum for a culture warrior like Bill O’Reilly who has to stoop to making his millions working in a cesspool like New York City; thank Christ for the suburbs. And even there, you see working women and nouveau riche tokens and two confirmed bachelors living in the same house—shit. But at least it’s better than living in a trailer park in Indiana where the air reeks of meth and hillbillies might make you vomit with their desperate ignorance of foie gras and four-syllable words.

The GOP is happy to cater to these people, too.

Which is why, though we hear that the GOP is just using sexism or racism or homophobia as a marketing tool—they don’t really hate those people; look at all the women and minorities and gays in their ranks!—they’re still out there selling protection of tradition, blowing that dog whistle like there’s no tomorrow…because even if they don’t hate the disenfranchised, their base does. And without that base, there really won’t be a tomorrow for the GOP.

[Originally published in similar form as “Tradition is the Ultimate Dog Whistle” at Shakespeare’s Sister in Oct. 2006. But, sadly, it bears repeating every campaign season.]

Advertisements

62 Comments

Filed under 01_shakespeares_sister

62 responses to “Did We Mention We’re White Doodz?

  1. Erin M

    Y’know, I just make this point in another thread, and here you go and make it a hundred times better.

    Guess that’s why you have a blog, and I don’t. 😉

  2. The reality that most families aren’t a picture of Christian white perfection, and never were, doesn’t stop people from imagining the opposite, however.

    And the ones that were that I grew up with in my nice WASPy suburb had kids that ended up in rehab or running away to join cults in Montana, or it turns out that the father was a drunk and the mom was screwing the golf pro at the country club.

  3. oddjob

    because it’s the ultimate GOP dog whistle

    In which is pointed out, as nothing else can as well, the transformation of the “Party of Lincoln” into the “Party of the Confederacy” (ie., the Dixiecrat Party).

  4. “The good old days” is one of those phrases that ought to be beaten silly and driven out of town–the good old days were rarely good by any reasonable measure.

  5. the good old days were rarely good by any reasonable measure

    What?–you don’t think “because it maintained the undeserved privilege of straight white men over everyone else” a reasonable measure?

    You’re weird.

  6. Pingback: Generation Chickenhawk at Shakesville

  7. Not only is that shorter than “sexist, racist, homophobic retrofuck jackholes,” but it sounds a lot nicer, too.

    And woe to the person that points out the (usually) thinly-veiled sexist, racist, or homophobic rhetoric being spewed by the GOP. How many times have I listened incredulously to Michele Bachman (a.k.a., The Clutcher) say that even though she is basing her entire political career on the premise that same-sex couples should be forever banned from having any rights and responsibilities even closely resembling those of straight married couples, she actually LOVES HoMoSEXuals (because they’re so good with her hair and makeup, natch). Of course she loves us, because without us she has nothing else to say, no target for her vitriol, no goat upon which to scape. With every ounce of effort she can muster, she feigns offense that somebody would even imagine suggesting that her words actually hurt people–don’t we know that she’s here to “protect” us?

    Great, go protect yourself. You’ll need to when people wake up and realize what kind of ride you and your ilk have been taking them on.

  8. One more time, with feeling: “Conservative” does not equal “Racist”. Blue states have much more per capita hate crimes per year than Red states (i.e., Minnesota has FIFTY TIMES the per capita race-based hate crimes of Alabama). Democratic voters are more likely than Republican voters to either not vote or ‘cross the aisle’ if their party’s candidate is Black.Self-identified Democrats are more likely to give high levels of aid to Whites and lower levels of aid to Blacks, while self-described Republicans are more likely to give all races an equal amount of aid.

    And the vast majority of the Dixiecrats remained prominent members of the Democratic Party well into the late 1980’s.

    http://www.deepthoughtblog.com/?cat=49

  9. And the vast majority of the Dixiecrats remained prominent members of the Democratic Party well into the late 1980’s.

    If you haven’t noticed, let me be the first to let you in on a little secret, Deep Thought: It’s 2007.

  10. nightshift66

    Incertus,
    My father, who came of age during the Depression, always scoffed at the ‘good old days’ hogwash. He said, “Sure, you could buy a Coke and a hamburger for 10 cents, but nobody had two nickels to rub together!”

    D.T., by contrast, is a model of Disraeli’s dictum that there are “lies, damned lies, and statistics.” Point by point:

    1. No one said conservative equals racist. However, nearly all racists are, in fact, political conservatives and reactionaries. You are confusing set and subset.

    2. As a bona fide resident of the Deepest South, I can vouch that hate crimes are vastly underreported as such here. Your data simply shows that the so-called Blue States are serious about prosecuting such crimes.

    3. Because any minority candidate for office is far more likely to be a Democrat that a Republican, there are far more times in any given election cycle that a Democrat faces that choice. Your party avoids the possibility by almost never running a woman or minority (see current presidential candidates). That is hardly a victory for women or minorities.

    4. Your sentence about aid references nothing: not type of aid, governmental or NGO, your source of the assertion, nothing. It is verbiage of the sort we’ve come to expect from the GOP, both content-free and untainted by any association with reality.

    5. The phenomena of the Dixiecrats is based on the historical facts that the Dems were the conservative party for many decades. But as you say, the Dixiecrats did switch to the GOP. I personally witnessed the flight to the GOP in the South of such bigots and racists, and the GOP welcomed them quite warmly. I would posit that correcting errors of the past is preferable to perpetuating such errors. But then, I always did have a preference for rationality and reasoning skills over propaganda and blind obedience to The Leader.

  11. One more time, with feeling: “Conservative” does not equal “Racist”.

    Let’s go back to basic reading comprehension, shall we? I didn’t say “conservative equals racist.” I specifically noted I was speaking about social conservatives, who define themselves specifically by conserving “social tradition,” which is empirically less egalitarian.

    As to the rest of your comment, I’m too tired to go into the debunking or proper contextualization of it all (e.g. “blue states” are more diverse and more populous so more hate crime is inevitable), but perhaps someone who hasn’t already done it a thousand times before will do it. Or we can all collectively choose to ignore it.

  12. Ah, I see Nightshift has done the job! Nice.

  13. Mustang Bobby,

    Here’s another hint: most of the Dixiecrats are dead or retired. Oddjob asserted that the Party of Lincoln became the Dixiecrat party. Not so. The Dixiecrats remained Democrats, and remained leaders of the Democratic Party, while still openly segregationist for decades after the Civil Rights Act was passed.
    Nightshift66,
    As an Atlantan i, too, can make a claim to authority.
    1. – They didn’t? Did you actually *read* what Melissa wrote? What the earlier comments said?
    2. – So you are telling me that the Atlanta Police Department (which is 60% Black officers, has over 55% of the ranks of sergeant and above filled by Blacks, with a Black chief of Police in the only major city with an uninterrupted string of Black mayors for 30 years in a state that is more than 50% Black) *HIDES* race-based hate crimes while the St. Paul Police Department (which is 85% White in a city that is 65% White and has virtually no Asian officers in a city with a major Asian population, has almost no minorities in ranks above corporal, and has a White police chief and a White mayor in a state that is only 4% Black) *DOESN’T* hide hate crimes? Pull the other one! Even if there is a major, hideous cover-up going on, it can’t account for Minnesota having THIRTY TIMES the race-based hate crimes of Georgia!
    3. – Who says I am a republican? I just hate stereotypes. The fact remains: when Republicans face the prospect of a Black Republican candidate, 25% of voters change parties or don’t vote; when Democrats face a Black Democrat nominee, 38% change parties or don’t vote.
    4. – Did you see the link at the bottom of my comment? You know, the one that leads to an piece with links and references? I will post it again at the bottom of this one so you can be sure to see it.
    5. – Flat out WRONG. Of all the self-proclaimed Dixiecrats, only a bare handful moved to the GOP; not only did the rest either go to the AIP or remain Democrats. Richard Russel was the president pro tem of the Senate while still opposing desegregation in the 1970’s!John Stennis ran as a Dixiecrat, “returned” to the Democratic Party and was rewarded by being setup as the first chairman of the Senate Ethics Committee!

    The fact is that Dixiecrats returned to the Democratic Party, were re-elected as Democrats, and were rewarded with leadership positions by the Democratic Party.

  14. Melissa,
    C’mon; don’t be disingenuous! This is old hat for you! How many times did you equate “Republican” with terms like ‘dog whistle’, tradition’, etc?

    As for Blue states being “more diverse” – please explain to me how Minnesota (which is 4% Black with the vast majority of Blacks in a single metro area) is more diverse than Georgia, which is 50% Black? I would love to here how you equate a state where Whites are the minority with *less* diversity!!

  15. C’mon; don’t be disingenuous!

    I’m not being disingenuous. I was responding to your erroneous assertion that I equated “conservative” with “racist.” I did not. I specifically said social conservatives.

    And I wouldn’t deny for a moment that I believe Republicans are racist, sexist, and homophobic. Look at their party platform. If someone isn’t racist, sexist, and homophobic and calls him/herself a Republican, they’re suffering from some profound cognitive dissonance, which isn’t really my problem.

  16. I would love to here how you equate a state where Whites are the minority with *less* diversity!!

    Racial diversity isn’t the only kind of diversity. Blue states have much higher LGBT populations, for example–and the LGBT community is the most targeted group as regards hate crimes.

  17. Pingback: University Update - Mitt Romney - Permanent Link to "Did We Mention We're White Doodz?"

  18. What? Atlanta has the fourth-largest population of same-sex couple in America! The PRIDE parade here this year was bigger than in Boston.

  19. Here’s another hint: most of the Dixiecrats are dead or retired. Oddjob asserted that the Party of Lincoln became the Dixiecrat party. Not so. The Dixiecrats remained Democrats, and remained leaders of the Democratic Party, while still openly segregationist for decades after the Civil Rights Act was passed.

    And once the act was passed, LBJ said “We [meaning the Democrats] have lost the South for the next two generations.” He was right. The GOP swooped into the South and plucked up the Southern Democrats with their “Southern Strategy.” Either you’re too young to remember or you’ve ignored the fact that the GOP has been using code words for racism since 1968 and done a great job of turning the South into a Republican stronghold. If you think they did it by promising lower taxes, well, have some cookies with your Kool-Aid.

    And Melissa is right; diversity isn’t just racial. It wasn’t the Democrats who came up with the Federal Marriage Amendment against gay marriage. The Republicans know all too well that the only minority left that it’s safe — for now — to pick on are the queers (World War II took all the fun out of anti-Semitism…). But the Mexicans and Muslims are pulling up fast.

  20. oddjob

    Here’s another hint: most of the Dixiecrats are dead or retired. Oddjob asserted that the Party of Lincoln became the Dixiecrat party. Not so. The Dixiecrats remained Democrats, and remained leaders of the Democratic Party, while still openly segregationist for decades after the Civil Rights Act was passed.

    Nice. A dissembler……….

  21. Sheesh! Did any of you go to the linked article with references? Why, oh why, would a racist need to change to the Republican party in 1968 when the very same Jim-Crow-Law-passing Democrats from 1967 were running for the same offices? And winning!

    “… the Democratic Party kept a death grip on the South in everything but Presidential elections until very, very recently. From Reconstruction until 2002 Georgia had only Democratic governors; from Reconstruction until 2005 Louisiana had only Democratic senators; Arkansas has had Democratic governors and senators since Reconstruction, only one Representative is not a democrat, the legislature is majority Democrat, and every state office is held by a Democrat; even Florida, home to a huge influx of non-Southerners, did not get a Republican governor and state legislature until 1998. All across the South there are dozens of political positions that have been held exclusively by Democrats from Reconstruction to the present day.

    If Southerners are racists that vote for racists, how did all those Democrats get elected in the almost 50 years since the Civil rights Act unless they are racists?”

  22. oddjob.
    “dis·sem·ble (dĭ-sĕm’bəl) pronunciation

    v., -bled, -bling, -bles.

    v.tr.

    1. To disguise or conceal behind a false appearance. See synonyms at disguise.
    2. To make a false show of; feign.”

    Um – sonce most Dixiecrats remained Democratic Party members and Part leaders, how did I dissemble?

  23. What? Atlanta has the fourth-largest population of same-sex couple in America! The PRIDE parade here this year was bigger than in Boston.

    Seriously, watching your mind work is amazing. I say “Blue states have much higher LGBT populations,” and you say “Atlanta’s pride was bigger than Boston’s,” as if that proves me wrong. It doesn’t. One city in one red state having a bigger pride parade than one city in one blue state does not mean that blue states don’t have a higher percentage of LGBT residents.

    And, not to state the obvious or anything, but in a state where same-sex couples have been granted marriage rights, gay pride is less politically significant than it is in a state where it has not. I’m also guessing that Atlanta’s pride draws a ton of regional visitors (like Chicago’s does) that Boston’s probably doesn’t, by virtue of being within spitting difference of a few other cities (like NYC) who have their own massive prides.

  24. Then riddle me this, Melissa:

    Atlanta is a bigger city than Boston
    Atlanta has a large Black population than Boston
    Atlanta’s same sex couple population is about as big as Boston’s

    Why does Boston have 3 times the per capita hate crimes of Atlanta?

    This is city to city, population to population. Atlanta is more diverse racially and about as diverse re: gender. Yet gays and Blacks are DEMONSTRABLY safer in Atlanta, that ninth ring of the Conservative South, than in oh-so-Progressive Boston.

    Can you tell me why?

  25. Sorry; that was largeR Black population than Boston.

  26. Whatever, Deep Thought.

    The point isn’t whether the South is more or less racist than the North. The point is that Republicans, as a party, do little or nothing to discourage racism, in either part of the country.

    Many of them, in fact, actively encourage it.

    Nice attempt at thread derailing, though.

  27. Melissa, will you PLEASE do me a favor? NEVER,EVER start a post with a reference to a video by Rachel Maddow.

    The extremes of my crushiness on her make it impossible for me to keep my mind on the post. 😉

  28. And to Deep Thought — there is some rather well-documented evidence that hate-crimes tend to actually get reported in more liberal cities than they do in more conservative areas, for a wide number of reasons. I’ll dig up some stats for you in a bit.

  29. Melissa, will you PLEASE do me a favor? NEVER,EVER start a post with a reference to a video by Rachel Maddow. The extremes of my crushiness on her make it impossible for me to keep my mind on the post.

    LOL! In fairness, I do temper it with the picture of my ugly mug. 😉

  30. oddjob

    It’s called lying with the truth. That the older generation died before they had the campaign to woo them over got into full swing doesn’t change the fact that at the present time the GOP more strongly identifies with the values of the Dixiecrats than the present day Democrats do.

    Something I’m sure even a dissembler like you will acknowledge when forced to.

  31. oddjob

    (Apologies for the lack of proofreading.)

  32. “LOL! In fairness, I do temper it with the picture of my ugly mug. ;)”

    Oh, like THAT’s any help with the crushiness problem! 😉

  33. I’ll dig up some stats for you in a bit.

    Actually, Deep Thought is a well known Pandagon troll, and stats will change nothing. It’s the Democrats who are the real racists, and never mind about the policies pursued by the Republican Party. That man behind the curtain is just the janitor. Look into DT’s eyes and KNOW THE TRUTH!

  34. Well, here’s an old one , from testimony in 1998.

    That report also indicated that, the worse a hate-crime was, the less likely it was to be reported, which means that a person of color in a fairly tolerant northern city might report for verbal harassment, because they thought they might actually be supported by law-enforcement, while a person of color in the rural south with a burning cross on their lawn might not report at all, because they were pretty sure that deputy bubba might have been in on it.

    I sat on a hate-crimes advisory board (in conjunction with police officers, lawmakers, reps of the GLBT, communities of color, etc) back in the early 90s. The trends in reporting, and the effects of political and social climates on reporting, were old news back then.

  35. If Southerners are racists that vote for racists, how did all those Democrats get elected in the almost 50 years since the Civil rights Act unless they are racists?

    Actually, it’s only slightly more than 40 years since the Civil Rights Act.

    Reasons for Democrats staying in local offices:
    1. The power of incumbency
    2. Voting habits die hard
    3. You need a deeper farm team of candidates to take over legislatures than to take over executive branches. That takes time to develop.

    Consider the parallel phenomenon of the Northeast Republican.

  36. Brynn

    and the LGBT community is the most targeted group as regards hate crimes.

    Ah, but you know those crimes don’t count as hate crimes! Advocating otherwise is advocating for “special rights”.

    This is a superb post!

    When I saw my righwing, conservative Catholic, older brother–who, btw, is a closeted, married “bisexual”. (I’d say “homo” but he prefers the “bi” designation and last time we discussed it, years ago, insists he doesn’t act on his same-sex desires because that would be against God’s will.) Anyway, when I saw him last autumn, we were watching TV news. I can’t remember the story, but it was playing on the scary “rising crime” meme, despite that fact that most violent crime rates have been dropping for years in the US. (Rape, I believe, and hate crimes are among the exceptions.) He turned to me and said something like, “Don’t you miss the good old days, when we were kids and this sort of thing didn’t happen?” He was floored when I responded vehemently, “No! I wouldn’t go back to those dark ages for anything! Sure, some white men had it great maybe, but it was open season on gays, lesbians, trans folks, and blacks!”

    In his lower working class white peer group–he sells cars–I honestly believe NO one ever disagrees with such patently false statements as he uttered. Given years of listening to the likes of O’Reilly, Limbaugh, Fox News, et al, they all just nod solemnly and go on believing the craziness, even when it is clearly to their personal detriment.

    DT, wake up. You’re at one of the best sites on the Web for getting deprogrammed. Make use of the opportunity!

  37. Rana,
    If such is the case, then why are there more hate crmes per capita in places that are, by one of the only measures available, “more Democrat” rather than “more Republican”? As I pointed out, Atlanta is more populous than Boston, has a (much) larger racial diversity, and has a LGBT community about as large; many more people voted Republican (percentage-wise) in Atlanta than in Boston, yet there is less hate crime per capita in Atlanta.

    This is easily verifiable. And despite the “I’ll quote something soon” comments, the FBI and international watch-dog agencies confirm that this is true. And, as I pointed out earlier, the Atlanta PD is *majority* Black with a Black chief of police and a Black mayor. Who is covering up these crimes? The majority-Black community? The majority-Black police department?

    Again: if Republicans are so automagically racist and homophobic, why is there so much less hate crime per capita where there are more Republicans?

  38. oddjob

    Atlanta is more populous than Boston, has a (much) larger racial diversity

    Where are your data for that?

  39. oddjob

    (The diversity part. The city is probably larger, although the metro area is probably smaller.)

  40. oddjob,
    The fact also still remains that Dixiecrats that were *still* openly segregationists and *still* kept the Jim Crow laws the authored in their CV’s were leaders in the Democratic Party into the 1990’s. If the Democrats rejected these men and their platforms, why were they still so prominent?

    JackGoff,
    I see your debating still primarily consists of “nuh-uh”. Its nice to see you again.

    That isn’t sarcasm – you’re like that cousin that you disagree with but still like.

  41. oddjob

    So far Deep Thought has only shown he’s good at lying with statistics, picking and choosing his anecdotes carefully.

  42. I see your debating still primarily consists of “nuh-uh”. Its nice to see you again.

    Nyuh-uh to correlative BS, mind. (Hint: it’s called confounding variables, for starters. I’m fairly certain I’ve told you that before.) Though, to be truthful, I’m no Democrat.

    That isn’t sarcasm – you’re like that cousin that you disagree with but still like.

    Couldn’t it be sarcasm? Please?

  43. oddjob

    If the Democrats rejected these men and their platforms, why were they still so prominent?

    Because the Democratic Party has a much broader ideological base, as anyone with even rudimentary political skills in this country already knows.

    Way to show off your ignorance.

  44. ellenbrenna

    Really? They were leaders in the Democratic Party in the 1980s and 1990s…open unrepentant segregationists…leaders in the NATIONAL Democratic Party?

    If their views represent the entire party…where were these people…were they giving keynote speeches at the Conventions in 1988, 1992? Were they even advocating repealing Civil Rights legislation in NATIONAL speeches in 1978, 1972?

    Do you understand how representative government in our limited 2 party system and the party platform system works? If segregationists get elected in any district that says more about the district then it says about party members in other districts.

  45. Oh, like THAT’s any help with the crushiness problem!

    LOL – Didn’t you get the memo? I’m fat and ugly and no one wants to fuck me.

  46. Dip Thought — Atlanta is not more populous than Boston — Get a Census link, dood.

    Here’s a quote from the 1998 APA paper “In 1996, only 16% of law enforcement agencies reported any hate crimes in their regions. Eighty-four percent of participating jurisdictions-including states with well-documented histories of racial prejudice-reported zero hate crimes.

    Another obstacle to gaining an accurate count of hate crimes is the reluctance of many victims to report such attacks. In fact, they are much less likely than other victims to report crimes to the police, despite-or perhaps because of-the fact that they can frequently identify the perpetrators. This reluctance often derives from the trauma the victim experiences, as well as a fear of retaliation.”

    Oh, and if you want some recent stuff from the FBI — how about the 2005 report — yes, there were only 17 reports from Georgia — but it only had 71 agencies reporting (see above), while Massachusetts had 371 reports from 267 agencies reporting. Do the math, zippy — that’s an average of 4.17 reports per reporting agency in Georgia, and .71 reports per reporting agency in MA.

    AND — the population density for Boston is 12,166 person/mile, while Atlanta’s pop. density is 3,126/mile. If you know any cops (which I do), you’ll know — more people/mile=more crime reports.

    Since your entire case was based on the fallacy that Atlanta, GA is more populous than Boston, MA, I will conclude by saying:
    Bite me.

  47. Oh, and Liss — I read that memo, but it burned my fingers, so I threw it in the trash, because I knew it was from teh Devil.

  48. I read that memo, but it burned my fingers, so I threw it in the trash, because I knew it was from teh Devil.

    LOL – All right then! Let the fucking commence!

  49. Jovan1984

    Tradition and conservative. Two more words that have a code in the black community, and neither are good codes.

    Tradition: 1. holding the status quo. 2. unwilling to change, even if the change is for the better.

    conservative: unwilling to accept change, even if it is for the better.

    So, conservative and tradition are both synonyms in our (black) community.

    Oh and for the record, these two words have the exact same code in the LGBT community.

  50. Portly,
    My error – I was discussing Georgia vs. mass and used the biggest cities, not the states.
    Besides, this isn’t my main point. My main point is that there are plenty of people (including Melissa, based on past posts) that are blind to the fact that hate crimes aren’t restricted to Macon County, Georgia nor are they exclusively the purview of toothless, feed-cap-wearin’ rednecks with too much Reb in their voice. It isn’t a “Southern Thing”, its farkin’ everywhere. These stereotypes ignore the fact that plenty of Lesbians are getting roughed up in Boston by people with college educations and that Blacks in the Twin Cities hear racist epithets from people who sound just like Fargo and go to the Lutheran Church for hot dish every week. There are far too many women who don’t go to the Whole Foods with their vegan boyfriends because they are ashamed of the bruises after a night of getting beaten up by those same ‘progressive’ guys.

    Oddjob,
    My point is that the Democratic Party had no problem maintaining these guys on the rolls of their party to increase their own political power. My point here is not “Republicans are pure as the driven snow”; my point is “both parties are more than willing to ally with whomever can get them power”. The Republicans were happy to let Strom Thurmond join them and the Democrats were happy to keep Richard Russell. To claim that ignoring or even tacitly encouraging racism is a ‘conservative thing’ is to ignore the fact that even many Progressives online are willing to forget the support these guys are *still* getting today in order to gain national political power. I refuse to give a penny to either party, but I know Progressives that proudly give cash to the DNC even after I point out that segregationists in Arkansas that work to deny Blacks the vote – and happen to be Democrats – will get money from the DNC just like anyone else that has a good chance of winning and is willing to put a -D after their name.

    What makes me get on the soapbox about this is the prejudice on display, right here. For example, according to the voting records, Melissa, poor White Americans tend to vote Democrat, not Republican. No, really – I have links to the research at that page i posted earlier. So while you and those like you keep beating the drum of “poor White Americans are soooooo scared and stupid that the GOP controls them!” they are, in fact, voting Democrat. If you think that isn’t a hateful prejudice against a class of people, you might want to rethink your suppositions.

  51. oddjob

    Okay, and so neither party is pure. DUH……

    Meanwhile, the reality based community continues to point out that the ones now elevating the pandering of bigotry to a fine art are dominated by Old Dixie.

    The Dems. are not that party.

    Dixie has always been wrong, and will always be so. It’s values are disgusting.

  52. We’re to ignore, of course, the fact that when more normalized numbers and statistics come out, they are dismissed as being beside the point.

    Alas, I’ve already believed my seven impossible things and had breakfast, so I’m afraid I’ll have to take note.

  53. “My main point is that there are plenty of people (including Melissa, based on past posts) that are blind to the fact that hate crimes aren’t restricted to Macon County, Georgia nor are they exclusively the purview of toothless, feed-cap-wearin’ rednecks with too much Reb in their voice. It isn’t a “Southern Thing”, its farkin’ everywhere.

    I don’t think that Melissa (or anyone one here is “blind” to that fact). Perhaps, though, you are blind to the fact that 60% of perpetrators of hate crimes are white.

    After you do a poll of the perpetrators political affiliations, and give me the statistics that show that they aren’t all either GOP or to the right of the GOP’s positions, I’d be glad to talk with you about your “point”.

  54. Portly,
    Wow. You mean that 75% of Americans are responsible for 60% of the hate crimes? How profound. How damning.

    BTW – I am mixed race, myself.

    Moira,
    *What* normalized numbers? I saw an article that some hate crimes are not reported, but that is, I assumed, *universal*, North and South, Red state and Blue state. Oh, and the shocking revelation that when there are fewer agencies per capita reporting hate crimes, they tend to report more crimes per agency. Not very surprising, really.

    oddjob,
    Ah, yes. You are all about hating prejudice. You hate people who judge others based upon their skin, or their beliefs, or their gender. Oh, and you also hate Southerners.
    Very, ah, Progressive of you.

  55. “Wow. You mean that 75% of Americans are responsible for 60% of the hate crimes? How profound. How damning.”

    Putz. You know very well that’s not what I was saying, but I’ll give you points for the spin “attempt”.

    And now, I will go and disinfect my hands with my special “de-trollifying solution”. I am done with you. Cheerio.

  56. amore

    I love how you cowards bail when you can’t win an argument.

  57. oddjob

    Oh, and you also hate Southerners.
    Very, ah, Progressive of you.

    No, I hate the values of the confederacy, but thanks again for the excellent display of dissembling.

  58. amore — Intentionally twisting someone else’s words is not “argument”.

    Intelligent argument is “a discussion in which reasons are advanced for and against some proposition or proposal.”

    When some moron comes in taunting people with a snide “riddle me this!”, using some statistic that Boston has more hate crime than Atlanta, even though Atlanta is more populous, and their facts are completely FALSE, and INCOMPLETE, and uncited, and then, when they are called on the carpet they say “Oh, my error — well that wasn’t my point anyway” . . . . THAT’S. NOT. AN. ARGUMENT!

    It’s bullshit. It’s trolling.

    And I’m quite aware that you are trolling too. And that I’ve made the mistake of actually allowing myself to get pissed off. Which I am.

    However, if you ever call me a coward again, you too-scared-to-include-a-link-bridge-dweller, you, I will regale you with stories of the crap I’ve survived in my lifetime which will have you curled up in a ball in a couple of seconds.

    Don’t you ever accuse me of cowardice. You have no idea who you’re talking to.

  59. Just wait ’til he busts out the reductio ad Stalinem. [spins in chair]

  60. Portly,
    But – the numbers remain. Mass still have many multiples of the hate crimes per capita of Alabama. Even if every police department in the South is chock a block full of the KKK nad each northern PD is full of ACLU members you must still strain every muscle in your brain to account for a difference of fifty time between Alabama ans Minnesota per capita.

  61. oddjob

    Not if Alabamans go way out of their collective way not to report the crimes.

    But then, acknowledging that would require the intellectual honesty you have repeatedly shown yourself NOT to have.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s